[politics?] code brown

"davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com" (davesaddiction)
10/23/2020 at 11:15 • Filed to: None

Jalopnik has always been political, I get that, but damn, sometimes it feels like some writers are actively trying to run readers off and lower their cratering readership even more.

Put yourself in the mindset of someone who was genuinely interested in the TRX, either as an actual potential buyer, or as just a gearhead who wants to learn about the tech specs and performance of this IRL monster machine . You see the wicked lede photo, you click on the article, looking for a little escape on your Friday morning...

Then, i n the second paragraph of his TRX review:

But everything that makes it impressive also makes it feel tone deaf in the face of the reality of 2020. The real unemployment rate in America !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , more Americans !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! and the majority of American adults have less than $1,000 in savings. Not to mention higher vehicle !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! , though not nearly as many as will be killed by !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

SMH... If this is really how you feel, why the hell are you burning more hydrocarbons to get yourself to the location for this review and then burning more driving this thing ? Just so you can come back and write up something shitting on it? I don’t get it. Boycott the event and just write the article condemning the thing, if that was the point all along.

DISCUSSION (100)

For Sweden > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:33

It’s me, buying lifestyle vehicles while also being worried that people may judge me for my lifestyle

benn454 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:35

They've been given a soapbox and they'll damn well use it.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > For Sweden
10/23/2020 at 11:36

This is why my wife won’t get a sporty car

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > For Sweden
10/23/2020 at 11:36

Which will be the bigger sales success: the TRX or the Hummer EV?

For Sweden > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/23/2020 at 11:37

Is your wife a hall monitor

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > benn454
10/23/2020 at 11:37

This soapbox isn’t going to get up on itself...

For Sweden > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:37

Hopefully the Hummer that thing looks awesome

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > For Sweden
10/23/2020 at 11:38

My lifestyle vehicle:

Kinja'd!!!

WasGTIthenGTOthenNOVAnowbacktoGTI > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:38

Yeah, Bradley writing that article maybe wasn’t the best idea, but with Andrew gone, the resident truck expert is no more.

I read the first 2 paragraphs, then decided to go read the review on MotorTrend.

HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles > For Sweden
10/23/2020 at 11:40

No just a very self conscious person. She still gets hung up on my BMW looking too fancy. She worries way too much about people thinking she might be putting on airs with her vehicle choice. Which is why she’s totally happy with her humble Honda hatchback.

Sovande > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:41

I read that article and while that part stood out, I thought it was good info to share. There is no reason for this truck to exist today. 10mpgs? How is it that is legal for a passenger car? I drive a 1987 El Camino that does better than that. We know for $112,000 Hummer created a huge truck with a ton of crazy tech and specs that are incredible. For $90,000 Dodge has come up with a truck with a big motor that returns horrible mileage. It's dumb.

Chariotoflove > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:41

Some people think that they need to hit everyone they meet over the head with their views. That’s when they call these things “blogs”. Those people are super boring at parties and they will do the same to the sites on which they write. It’s the editor’s fault for allowing it and not corralling his staff.

For a local contrasting example, I was on The Takeout week before last, reading some fun article about some yummy treat or other. First commenter comes on and rants that “we have over 200,000 people dead from covid , and you’re talking about fluff like this! This is a stupid fucking article! ” (I paraphrase). The editor responded in the comments that people have a right to enjoy things, and t0ld him that he could pound sand with his “stupid fucking comment” if he didn’t like it. I slow clapped for him in my mind.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > HFV has no HFV. But somehow has 2 motorcycles
10/23/2020 at 11:41

I will never understand people who are willing to give up some of their personal joy in life because of what other people might think of them.

Did some people think I was an asshole because I drove a BMW ? I’m sure, but that’s on them . They don’t know me. I had a BMW because I LOVED the way it drove, sounded, and felt on backroads & track. It gave me joy , and I’ll be damned if I’ll let someone’s side-eye take that from me.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > For Sweden
10/23/2020 at 11:42

Probably only walks on sidewalks.

fintail > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:42

The best idea is to avoid FP.

Nothing > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:43

It’s inevitable. Jalopnik migrates towards “ cars as tech” (Hi, The Verge!), gets folded into Gizmodo. Anyone that still has a smidge of car interest goes to The Drive.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo
10/23/2020 at 11:43

Yes!

For Sweden > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:43

And probably avoids cocaine like some sort of nerd lol

qbeezy > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:43

That whole preface gave me a headache. They know that this vechiles release was way ahead of whatever happened in 2020. Also, the unemployment situation is sad, but people who do buy these trucks dont need the trucks. There’s plenty of cool and affordable vehicles. Using your soapbox when in appropriate hurts more than not saying anything at all.

I like cars: Jim Spanfeller is one ugly motherfucker > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:44

I feel like these people generally don’t read Jalopnik

I don’t click the actual car stories anymore. I just come for the what car should I buy, the ones where the entire story is just one long Bad Take, and the occasional Torch rambling or Tracy wrench story.

WilliamsSW > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 11:45

I think my response would have been “we have over 200,000 people dead from covid, and you’re reading fluff like this and commenting on it! You’re a selfish idiot!”

way2blu does a rev update > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:45

Having taken a fair number of marketing classes, I had some opinions on the article too. Nothing against Bradley or his overall style, just thoughts on the specific post.

Full disclosure: I, way2blu, with my Very Small Car, love the idea of a big adventure truck that can do jumps. I don’t think I could accept the irony of having outdoor adventures in nature while doing 10 mpg worth of damage to that environment the whole while.

Sometimes knowing an article’s audience is really important. The TRX is a badass truck that’s an exciting proposition for a lot of people. To take a “big picture” tone and talk negatively about the vehicle because it’s not affordable or sustainable for 95% of the USA’s population is to miss the point completely.

The “if it bleeds, it leads” attitude that’s been popular in journalism for centuries is even more counterproductive when writing the debut review for a truck that people buy for fun.

Personally, I’d have brought up the Hummer EV somewhere in the article as a counterpoint. I know it probably came out after the text copy for the post was complete, but it’s too relevant not to include.

We’re all enthusiasts here, and there are plenty of things to be enthusiastic about. Yes, there’s definitely need for more serious discussions too, but in an article about what’s probably the most fun offroad rig yet, that’s not the point.

Roadkilled > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:46

I know far too many people who believe that America has many problems that need to be solved, but it’s somebody else’s responsibility to do something about it. Everybody wants to maintain their level of “freedom” while making others cover the cost.

If climate change is that big of an issue to you, don’t buy any new car or truck. Take public transit or ride a bike.

If you love cars, at least buy an older fuel efficient used car. Keep something running and out of the junk yard. Don’t let a vehicle become trash just because it’s old.

There, that’s my turn on the soap box.

Chariotoflove > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 11:46

Part of living in a free society is having the freedom to make dumb choices on how you spend your money. They key is to keep everyone else from suffering the consequences of someone questionable choice. The mechanism here for doing that is the CAFE standards. Dodge has to balance the over all offerings to meet them. So, I guess if they make this truck and sell it, they have to make up for its wastefulness elsewhere. It’s an imperfect system, but at least we have one that is making our environment better than it was a generation ago.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 11:47

Okay, fine. But wouldn’t it be more appropriate as a conclusion at the end, rather than a reminder of just how much the world sucks right now?

WE KNOW. WE GET IT. I’M ALREADY DEPRESSED CAN I JUST FORGET THAT FOR A MINUTE AND READ ABOUT THIS SILLY TRUCK I CAN’T AFFORD FOR ONE MINUTE?!

Chariotoflove > WilliamsSW
10/23/2020 at 11:47

Yeah! “ Get out there and save some babies or something, you slacker!”

Jim Spanfeller > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:49

And even when they’re not shoving their political opinions down your throat, they’re shoving EVs down your throat. Sure, they’ll make some lame attempt to not alienate their readers who aren’t a fan of EVs, but they’ll do so in a way that feels backhanded. Jalopnik has always been opinionated, but I never felt like it was hostile until recently. They’re no longer a site for people who love cars. They no longer care to find out why people are passionate about the vehicles they like. They’ve lost their sense of fun. Th ey’ve devolved into a site of cynical grumps. And you know what? The real world has enough problems already, I don’t need to put up with Jalopnik’s crap, they had their chance and they blew it. I’m done with them.

HammerheadFistpunch > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:50

It’s a brownell story, that’s par for the course.

Equal parts “I burn dinos for fun ” and “shame on YOU ALL for driving”

AestheticsInMotion > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 11:54

Jalopnik seems like a car site full of writers who hate cars. Which is too bad, considering how great it used to be

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > AestheticsInMotion
10/23/2020 at 11:57

Not sure if they hate cars, but they sure hate a lot of people who love cars.

Sovande > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 11:57

I agree 100%, choices are important. That doesn’t make this truck any less dumb. Nor does it negate the fact that the truck gets 10mpgs.

Does Dodge actually have to sell the lesser emitting cars to offset these, or do they simply have to offer cars that could offset these? If Dodge sells 100 of these, do they have to sell 150 of something else, or do they just h ave to offer those vehicles for sale? At the end of the year , if Dodge sold 100 TRX trucks and only 50 of the offsetting cars, what is the penalty?

Sovande > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:02

Ha, I suppose. I think it’s more impactful for the author to tell the reader the premise right up front. In this case the premise is this is a giant death machine returning horrible numbers and directly violating the spirit of the bailou t terms they agreed to a short 10 years ago.

The entire idea of this truck is dumb. Is there a factory truck racing series? Would any real trophy truck racer go down to the local Dodge dealership and buy this and t hen race it? I wouldn’t imagine so, right ? You’d build a racecar. So is it for? And why?

Nick Has an Exocet > HammerheadFistpunch
10/23/2020 at 12:02

Exactly. The guy goes on the same rallies that I do and wastes just as much gas. Sometimes more because he drives from Nevada to get there. Do as I say, not as I do.

Personally, I think climate guilt is stupid. If you have to shame other people to feel good about yourself, get a shrink not an EV.

CarsofFortLangley - Oppo Forever > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:03

I was always amused by Ballaban who would decry the evils of capitalism (fair points) despite being employed to review the most capitalistic thing (cars) and driving a lexus wagon (albiet used).

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 12:05

Okay, if that’s the take, why go drive it? Why give it any attention at all? Publicity is publicity (see also: Trump).

50ford500 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:08

A good many of the posters aren’t any better. I got throughly scolded by a self righteous one the other day for the audacity of agreeing with a comment on an article that the site should focus on cars and car related content; not politicizing everything. I was told this line of thinking makes someone an awful human being because you’re ignoring Inequalities and injustice by not crowing about it all the time and that cars are entirely political. I even politely reminded said person there are at least two blog sections almost entirely related to political issues to talk about matters like that. I stopped communicating after that. Reading some of his/her past comments it seems they live eat sleep and breathe social issues. I’m presuming this is the base they want to cater to there because Brownelle and Orlove can’t seem to go 10 minutes without dropping something like that.

Sovande > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:08

I get your point - they need to review it because the need readers but at the same time they alienate those readers in the first paragraph of the review. Which is dumb. They should write a truck review and a follow up of personal opinions about the truck, perhaps. I don’t know - moving forward I think I will just start doing what they seem to want readers to do and read reviews on other sites.

I think I am focused more on how absurd the truck seems than the article describing it’s absurdity.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > 50ford500
10/23/2020 at 12:11

Exactly why I’m having this discussion here on OPPO and not in the Jalop comment section. Most people here are reasonable.

Sovande > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:16

I think this is the only attitude that works. Ice Cube summed it up perfectly in the lyrics to Gangsta Gangsta from NWA’s seminal work “Straight Outta Compton.”

Since I was a youth, I smoked weed out,

Now I’m the motherfucker that you read about,

taking a life or two, that’s what the hell I do,

Don’t like how I’m living, well fuck you.

dumpsterfire! > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:18

My dad mailed me a paper copy of National Review earlier this year and there was a review of the new Yukon or some such XL SUV. Every other paragraph had a mention of pissing off libtards with its mpg or some such drivel. The editors red pen should have been more aggressive for a car review, but I assume that's the way things have devolved.

Textured Soy Protein > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:18

In my experience a lot of people who love cars are shitheads, so...

duurtlang > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 12:19

I agree; you are free to do whatever you want, but your freedom ends when it starts impeding on the freedom of others. I think that’s a general rule most developed countries live by.

One could argue that the CAFE standards are not good enough though, in this context. A commuter that gets 10 mpg is at the very least morally questionable. One could even argue excessive fuel consumption and THUS excessive greenhouse gas emissions (something CAFE ignores) is to some extent impeding on the freedom of others. As is having a vehicle that is intentionally unsafe to others ( “ higher vehicle grille heights are killing pedestrians ” ).

I’m not sure what the comments about unemployment rate and car payments are about though. The former is a political/economical issue, the latter a poor personal choice one.

50ford500 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:21

lol exactly. I know we may not all agree on everything but at the end of the day it’s about cars and well...we all are pretty enamored with them so let’s just have some fun and talk about stuff we like

KingT- 60% of the time, it works every time > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:23

That was a stupid preachy holier than thou hot take. Let people buy what they want. If someone can spend $90K+ on a Tesla S or Taycan someone else can very well damn spend the same or more on a Raptor/Trx .

Now, If you want government to incentivize cheap renewables and electric vehilces and curtail polluting ICE vehicles that’s a different discussion. It’s not tone-deaf from the manufacturer, they’re just making products based on consumer demand and competition.

Textured Soy Protein > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 12:23

CAFE standards are based on the mean efficiency of the overall manufacturer’s offered vehicles. Not how many they sell. So for example RAM inefficiency is offset by Fiat 500 efficiency, regardless of how many RAMs or Fiat 500s are sold.

Pickup_man > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:24

Even as a lover of all things pickup I don’t think it’s necessarily wrong to point those thing out, because they are real issues and the TRX does seem a little ignorant to at least some of them, but yeah, that state ment really set a negative tone to the article and it was hard to take anything he said, either positive or negative very seriously.

ItalianJobR53 - now with added 'MERICA and unreliability > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:26

Big yes!

Jb boin > Roadkilled
10/23/2020 at 12:26

This is the right take, being aware that this car (or a sportscar for example) is not a good thing for the environment doesn’t mean that you have to be offended if someone points that out even if you own one (or would like to), you just have to be aware of it and accept it .

I drive more powerful and pol luting car than i need to but i am not proud of it and won’t be mad if someone points that out to me as they will be right to tell so .

D riving (and pol luting) for our pleasure is a privilege but we are only human so we won’t always do the right thing (and what is “generally” right is not always what feels/is right for ourselves) .

Textured Soy Protein > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 12:27

Fuel economy and environmental impact are not the only ways that bigass trucks can potentially impact people who don’t drive bigass trucks. The bigass trucks can also crash into other smaller vehicles and/or pedestrians, and all else being equal, getting crashed into by a bigger-asser vehicle is less survivable than getting crashed into by a less-bigass vehicle.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:29

It was an odd choice to put that at the beginning. I think a similar point could have been worked in as a context paragraph before the end but perhaps in a less agg ressive manner. Doesn’t help that he always comes across as overly defensive of any criticism whatsoever in the comments.

Sovande > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 12:31

Interesting, thanks for the explainer. So basically, it’s horseshit.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 12:32

And now he’s (maybe?) a Trump supporter. LOL

Honestly, I completely get where he’s coming from. Ds have taken the black vote for granted for too long.

HammerheadFistpunch > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 12:33

I was under the impression that volumes mattered. i.e. you can’t sell a single EV for 100 demons and call it a wash, its weighted against volumes.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Pickup_man
10/23/2020 at 12:34

If you’re going to make a conclusion... make it at the conclusion.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 12:35

In my experience, a lot of people who love cars are shitheads.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > AestheticsInMotion
10/23/2020 at 12:35

Miss Mercedes is going to be writing some stuff for them soon so maybe that can offset that a little. They need more writers who can appreciate a car for what it is both in context and for its own inherent qualities and don’t just see any internal combustion as one more blow against a dying planet.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > dumpsterfire!
10/23/2020 at 12:35

So frustrating.

Chariotoflove > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 12:36

I agree that the truck is dumb. That’s why I wouldn’t read the article. If I were someone who wanted to read about this truck, though, I don’t think I would take kindly to clicking, reading, and being told that it’s dumb and I shouldn’t be interested in it if I’m a good person. Most of the FP articles are about cars we will never buy. They are entertainment. I don’t think it’s very entertaining to be told you’re a bad person. I think it would be kind of like if you were the kind of person who, for a harmless fantasy, rented Sorority Girls 7 in your hotel room, and the movie started out with 15 min. of exposition about how many sorority girls are raped and abused at colleges every year. So much for the fantasy.

Chariotoflove > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 12:38

True. I think that’s one of the reasons why people these days buy raised SUVs in stead of cars. When one is sitting at a light surrounded by tall crew cabs, etc., it can seem like a survival necessity to get something on a par.

I, however, will never be a big ass truck person. I find them excessive.

Chariotoflove > HammerheadFistpunch
10/23/2020 at 12:38

I thought so too, although I have to admit that I haven’t researched it.

BigBlock440 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:39

and the majority of American adults have less than $1,000 in savings.

And they still trot out complete bullshit (though that’s nothing new). In both studies/polls I found (one was $400, the other $1,000), the question was asked “how would you pay for the emergency expense”. The survey asking about $400 said “check all that apply” and added up to 140-ish %, the one asking about 1,000 I couldn’t find, but the published percentages added to 88%, so I’m inclined to believe that they left some responses off the chart on that one too.

Kinja'd!!!

Question EF5B. How would a $400 emergency expense that you had to pay impact your ability to pay your other bills this month

Response/ Percent

I would still be able to pay all of my other bills in full/ 85

I could not pay some other bills or would only make a partial payment on some of them/ 14

Refused/ 1

Note: Number of unweighted respondents = 9,670.

Granted, 14% is still a lot of people, but just because the majority of Americans wouldn’t pull money out of their savings to pay an unexpected expense doesn’t mean they don’t have it or it’s a national emergency.

WilliamsSW > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:39

BRB I’m getting on my private jet to go to a conference on climate change

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > Nick Has an Exocet
10/23/2020 at 12:39

Well, climate guilt to a point. Buying a brand new car every year is worse for the environment than driving a used F350 over the same time period* but it will increase local pollution as opposed to pollution somewhere else and different sorts of pollution too. You have to examine what waste you can reasonably eliminate from your life and how egregious said waste is. Recycling takes no effort at all and there’s little excuse not to. Now burning trash because you don’t feel like paying for a trash service is not the same as driving a car that gets 4 mpg fewer than another car you considered but both are still choices with consequences for both yourself and others.

* citation needed

Textured Soy Protein > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 12:39

It’s not complete horseshit, at least insofar as it encourages manufacturers to offer more efficient vehicles to hit their CAFE numbers. Even if the manufacturers aren’t required to sell a lot of those more efficient vehicles to hit their CAFE numbers , they still have to go through the trouble of designing and manufacturing them. All of which costs money they want to recoup by selling them. Sure, they don’t have to try to make a huge effort to sell them, and other less-efficient/higher-margin vehicles can somewhat defray these costs.

Needless to say, CAFE standards are highly politicized because there are all sorts of different special interests at play in the car business, and any regulations affecting the overall business affect the different players in the business differently. Everybody has different skin in the game and lobbies to get the standards tweaked in their favor as much as possible.

Cash Rewards > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:41

How is that paragraph political though? Those are facts. Supported by the articles referenced. He’s not saying the unemployment rate is due to Republican policies, or americans are behind on car payments because the house is stalling a stimulus. He’s just citing relevant facts, without bias, to support an opinion . Yes, this whole blog network skews liberal (less so since the deadspin thing), but this isn’t it.

Grill heights are a danger for democratic and republican children.

But those little libertarian brats can get crushed for all I care (I kid, I kid).

Textured Soy Protein > HammerheadFistpunch
10/23/2020 at 12:44

Yeah I should clarify. It’s based on number of vehicles produced. Obviously car manufacturers want to actually sell those vehicles, but they can look at their overall fleet projected sales and say, for example, “well we’re going to make this many bigass trucks that will put us this much out of compliance for CAFE, so let’s make just enough smaller more efficient cars we don’t want to try and sell at low margins to get in compliance, but no more.”

kanadanmajava1 > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:45

I do like reviews that aren’t only speaking about positive things. Re views that do nothing but praise things appear to me as paid advertisements.

That one chapter about unemployment rates etc di d seem to be quite non-relevant to the truck review though . Those things were all negative issues but quite unrelated with each other .

nermal > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:51

We’re talking about $90k of GODDAM FREEDOM in truck form.

Almost e very other person that has driven it: “WOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!”

jEllOpicNic: “I’m offended!”

Consumer Reports: “ Excessive exhaust noise and whining sound from front of vehicle makes bluetooth phone calls impossible. Do not recommend . ”

Mercedes Streeter > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
10/23/2020 at 12:51

Full time, to be exact! You’re going to see a lot of me! :)

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:52

Those unemployed Americans and those with zero savings are not in the market for a $100k truck. This is a truck for the man/lady who is doing just fine. We should start shaming people for living where they want to live, perhaps eating nice foods, maybe even paying for a haircut! Who NEEDS to look nice or a humble sirloin? Nobody, that's who.

Textured Soy Protein > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 12:53

Here’s my experience driving around Madison, WI and now my corner of the close-in DC burbs.

In Madison, plenty of people had bigass pickups as their plain old regular putz around town car. Of those who I interacted with, it was a mix between people who just liked trucks, and people who deluded themselves that they needed those trucks, even though their justifications made no sense.

In DC, until you get farther out from the city than where I live, there just aren’t that many privately owned pickups. There are mass quantities of crossovers, up to and including 3 row models, but full size truck- based SUVs have really fallen off. Back 15 years ago when they were the main way to get a 3+ row vehicle that wasn’t a minivan they were much more popular here but that’s been largely replaced by 3-row crossovers. I see more full-on exotics like Ferraris, McLarens etc than I see Suburbans. 90% of the brodozers here are Wranglers, with a smattering of 4Runners & FJs, and the very occasional pickup.

I personally love all kinds of stupid vehicles, and while I’m not a huge truck fan I can appreciate their particular brand of excess. But since I gravitate to low-to-the-ground performance cars, driving among mass quantities of crew cabs is not desirable to me. At least here I’m more likely to get hit by a Honda Pilot than a crew cab pickup.

BigBlock440 > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 12:56

Not true, fuel standards are based on the vehicles footprints, and credits/fines are based on how many they sell. A high-selling vehicle that exceeds the standard could offset another vehicle that falls short of the standard.

https://one.nhtsa.gov/cafe_pic/CAFE_PIC_home.htm

Danimalk - Drives a Slow Car Fast > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:56

I get what you’re saying, but since when is unemployment , safety regulations, and climate change political? Politicians talk about these things, sure, they will say whatever they want about those topics. B ut these are real considerations /issues people in a society have to deal with, not just some dude’ s political opinion .

Spanfeller is a twat > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 12:57

Climate change and pedestrian safety are relevant political issues to delve upon. I guess income inequality matters very little because it’s neither new to america, nor something they’d care if it was a Tesla, or a BMW, or a Toyota. They only care because it’s a pointless 700hp vehicle that is not only shitty to the environment and deadly, but also expensive. The epitome of jackassery .

DC3 LS, Fuck Hyundai, now and forever > AestheticsInMotion
10/23/2020 at 13:01

So K inja is just politically correct 4chan now?

Pickup_man > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 13:02

I probably would have still pointed it out at the beginning , but in more of a “I would be remiss to not point out that these are real problems in the world and this particular truck kind of flies in the face of some of them, but here’s what I think of it outside of these circumstances. I’ll leave it up to you to decide whether this is acceptable or not ” Brad’s style is much more, “H ere’s everything that sucks about the world and it’s because of trucks like this and people like you who enjoy these types of things that the world is the way it is. You should feel bad about it. But I’m a journalist who isn’t going to pass up an opportunity for fun and since I won’t be buying one I’m not part of the problem. Even if there are things I like about it which influence you to buy one that’s on you, not me, and you’re the problem here. So here’s my review because I guess I’m obligated to give it to you.”

This feels a bit harsh, Brad seems like an ok dude, but sometimes his takes and guilt tripping come off as a bit much and occasionally hypocritical .

Textured Soy Protein > BigBlock440
10/23/2020 at 13:08

Not sure if you’re replying to my original or follow-up comment but the key phrase there is “ produced for sale.”

Chariotoflove > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 13:10

The bigger trucks and SUVs are more common where I live. I shake my head at the huge trucks with huge tires that never pull a load or go off road. But a lot of them do pull stuff. I guess I can’t judge based off of what I see in a parking lot on Sunday. It could be someone’s everything car. I dunno.

But I have a lot of neighbors who also have two Suburbans or Tahoes in the driveway and love them for everything that family cars do.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > Mercedes Streeter
10/23/2020 at 13:14

I hope they make good use of you because you’re the most authentic, original writer they’ve had in a while. I feel like you could appreciate just about anything for what it is so I feel you’ll be loved by the people who still come around for Torch and Tracy especially. Good luck with all that! You’ll do great! Be yourself!

Oh, and ignore the haters in the comments but try to have some good interactions with some of the more reasonably constructed comments. People notice that and it keeps them coming around.

Textured Soy Protein > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 13:31

The thing is unless you go up to a Suburban, most 3-row crossovers have more room inside than most 3-row BOF SUVs. This includes passenger space, and cargo space, especially behind the 3rd row.

Here are 3 cargo areas, from an Escalade, Highlander, and Atlas.

Kinja'd!!!

Their respective dimensions are...

Escalade - 203.9" L x 80.5" W x 74.4" H; 5856 lbs; 15.2 cu ft luggage

Highlander - 194.9" L x 76" W x 68.1" H ; 4450 lbs; 16.0 cu ft

Atlas - 198.3" L x 78.3" W x 70" H; 4502 lbs; 20.6 cu ft

Putting aside the fuel economy, just looking at the dimensions, u nless BOF SUV owners are using t he extra towing capacity or other trucky capabilities, the people- and stuff-carrying capability is demonstrably worse than much smaller and lighter unibody alternatives.

Now, as I said before, I’m far from someone who buys vehicles purely based on needs . Where it gets murky for me is when people claim they bought a particular vehicle because it fulfills some need of theirs, but a smaller, lighter, more efficient, and safer-to-others vehicle better fulfills their needs. Their supposedly need-based choice has an impact on others, and yet there are other choices available to them that would both be better suited to their needs and impact others less. Which, when it comes down to it, is kinda selfish.

Chariotoflove > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 13:34

Eh, I bought a minivan, which I feel is much better for most people hauling needs than almost any crossover, and better for most other stuff too. But, people want what they want.

Nick Has an Exocet > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
10/23/2020 at 13:51

I think you missed my point. Shaming other people is an A-hole thing to do. Especially when you’re perfectly happy to be a hypocrite and drive the press car around.

Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available > Nick Has an Exocet
10/23/2020 at 13:57

That too. I was more responding to the second half of your comment but I wholeheartedly agree with the first. He’s the one who drove the dang thing so is he being tone deaf by publicizing it? According to his own rules, yes.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > Sovande
10/23/2020 at 14:00

We need a wholesale revision of how things are priced, factoring in their environmental impacts and actually directing funds from that pricing towards programs that help further those goals. Right now, as you noted, manufacturers only have to “offer” an offsetting vehicle to make up for unnecessarily harmful vehicles like these, gas is too cheap, and even concepts like carbon credits that were wholesale free market conservative ideas towards addressing climate change have been replaced with “but we simply don’t believe it’s a real issue” .

Without getting too far off on tangents, I simply don’t get how we can live in such a bubble. We have the rest of the world as examples of other humans with rational thoughts and all the various things they are doing to address various issues, and not devolving in to the tyrannical communist nightmares that we are supposedly hellbent on avoiding at (literally) all cost.

Textured Soy Protein > Chariotoflove
10/23/2020 at 14:01

Well yeah minivans are better still but that’s a bridge too far for many people who drive SUVs.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > dumpsterfire!
10/23/2020 at 14:10

Ha, funny to think that the National Review does vehicle reviews. I do check them out sometimes just to get “the other side”’s perspectives from my own (in general)...and they usually run the gamut from “OK that’s a classically conservative, yet reasonable take” to well, full on Trump ass kissing. I guess when you’re already catering to that side of the aisle exclusively there’s little to lose and more to gain by throwing some red meat to the crowd with silly zingers like that. Doesn’t help the national discourse one bit, but it’s an easy way to entertain your core audience.

ZHP Sparky, the 5th > fintail
10/23/2020 at 14:12

I usually just end up reading/commenting on Tom’s articles and maybe a QOTD or NPoCP (or whatever the hell it is now called) depending on how interesting it seems. Beyond that, even without getting in to the personalities or writing traits of the authors most of the topics seem like pretty hot garbage.

Mercedes Streeter > Who is the Leader - 404 / Blog No Longer Available
10/23/2020 at 14:16

They will!

I like to think I could see the good in any vehicle from the Yugo to the PT Cruiser. Every car has a redeeming trait !

I’ve also long felt the community is definitely a huge plus that Jalopnik has that other sites I’m sure could only wish for. I especially love to see the authors engaging with said community, even if it’s involving criticism.

Mercedes Streeter > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 14:22

Not to mention, RAM also has an ecoDiesel as well. They sell enough fuel efficient vehicles to sell things that absolutely gulp fuel down.

BigBlock440 > Textured Soy Protein
10/23/2020 at 14:55

This one

“CAFE standards are based on the mean efficiency of the overall manufacturer’s offered vehicles. Not how many they sell. So for example RAM inefficiency is offset by Fiat 500 efficiency, regardless of how many RAMs or Fiat 500s are sold.”

It does matter how much of each are sold (or technically produced, but more or less the same thing since they’re not going to overproduce enough if nobody buys them).

Relevant text:

A credit is earned for each 1/10 of an mpg in excess of the fleet’s standard mpg and the actual average mpg. Total credits are calculated as the number of tenths of an mpg (1/10 mpg) times the number of vehicles produced for that fleet . On the other hand, if a manufacturer’s actual average mpg level for a given fleet does not meet the applicable standard, then the manufacturer has a “shortfall” for that fleet.

It’s broken out into 3 categories, the TRX and 500 would be in separate categories as well.

BigBlock440 > ZHP Sparky, the 5th
10/23/2020 at 14:58

We need a wholesale revision of how things are priced, factoring in their environmental impacts and actually directing funds from that pricing towards programs that help further those goals.

You mean like a gas guzzler tax and CAFE credits? This is a $70k-110k truck we’re talking about here. It’s priced in so they can lose $14k on every 500e they sell.

Textured Soy Protein > BigBlock440
10/23/2020 at 15:33

Well I already corrected myself so there’s no need to nitpick the comment before the correction.

https://oppositelock.kinja.com/1845464090

You are correct on the separate fleets and footprints but what you left out is that both of these things allow for more production of big inefficient vehicles.

The “light truck” fleet has the lowest CAFE standards, and includes everything from crossovers to full size trucks. If we stick with the FCA example, stuff like the Jeep Renegade and Fiat 500X are helping offset the bigass trucks, in clearing the lower “light truck” CAFE bar.

Derpwagon > Mercedes Streeter
10/23/2020 at 16:03

Hey once you’re full time, can I get followed again to get out of the greys? That’d be a damn miracle.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > BigBlock440
10/23/2020 at 16:11

Yeah, but nuance takes too long.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > WilliamsSW
10/23/2020 at 16:12

Ha! At least that Greta girl recognizes the hypocrisy...

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Cash Rewards
10/23/2020 at 16:14

Yeah, there’s a better word for it. Note the question mark in my title...

We are living in the age of alternative facts.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > kanadanmajava1
10/23/2020 at 16:16

Oh, if it’s a shitty truck, by all means shit on it, on the merits.

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > nermal
10/23/2020 at 16:16

LOL

davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com > Pickup_man
10/23/2020 at 16:21

He’s definitely comes off as “you people suck“ quite a bit.

WilliamsSW > davesaddiction @ opposite-lock.com
10/23/2020 at 16:26

Wait- she hasn’t done that, has she?

I was more thinking about the Hollywood-types and other various rich people - no one specific - when I typed that.